Philosophy Classes

topic posted Mon, October 8, 2007 - 8:27 AM by  shaman sun
Anyone else feel that they're a bit limited to being eurocentric?
posted by:
shaman sun
New York City
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    Re: Philosophy Classes

    Mon, October 8, 2007 - 8:19 PM
    not anymore
    i took an african religion and philosophy class once
    the teacher renamed it african sprituality and deep thought
    it was very enlightening to my eurocentrism

    did you know that many of the greeks studied in africa?
    and we thought they made it all up
    when the egyptians should get all of the credit
  • Re: Philosophy Classes

    Tue, October 9, 2007 - 10:56 PM
    Most of them, yes.
    Most are incredibly eurocentric
    • Re: Philosophy Classes

      Tue, October 9, 2007 - 11:11 PM
      Incredible, yes. Lots to be learned I suppose. Yet there's a world right over that hill, yep, to the east. . . Where the east lies waiting, always, already present :P Or so they say . . .

      I'd like to see a healthier balance of the two. I'm going to try to do this in our Philosophy club. The last time there was alot of resistance. "What was that? You aren't teaching Hegel? Kant? Heidegger? Sartre? Well then,hat is it you're talking about outside of purely scholarly academics? Aha, eastern stuff. Yes, let me tell you about that stuff, about non-rational ..." etc etc . . .
      • Re: Philosophy Classes

        Wed, October 10, 2007 - 12:47 AM
        Two? Don't forget there was life to the North, life to the South, life to the West. The natives of America had their own phiolosphies, as did the nomads of the steppes, the tribes of the Sahara, the farmers and empire builders of the Nile, the bushmen of Australia, and the sea-harvesters of Polynesia. Philosophy is not only a thing for monks and priests and aristocracy.
        • Re: Philosophy Classes

          Wed, October 10, 2007 - 10:48 AM
          I guess I sorta lump them into the second half . . . Because they're rejected as voodoo in most cases.
          • Re: Philosophy Classes

            Wed, October 10, 2007 - 6:09 PM
            Hah! I suppose they are at that. I'd love to see a philosophy class that actually covered the world-view encompassed in some of the actual voodoo practices. Interesting take on life, desires, ethics, and value.
            Of course, I'd also like to take a philosophy class that didn't treat the practice as if it were some remote and esoteric disciplin available only to the worthy initiates of the ivory tower. Horse pucky!
            • Re: Philosophy Classes

              Wed, October 10, 2007 - 10:46 PM
              Horse Pucky indeed.
              • Re: Philosophy Classes

                Thu, October 11, 2007 - 4:58 PM
                Yes, in general philosophy classes do tend to be Eurocentric. They engage a body of critical argumentative writing that by and large comes from Europe and the United States. Contrast 2 senses of the word "philosophy"

                broad sense: thinking about stuff, worldviews, the "love of widsom" (transliteration from the greek)

                narrow sense: a tradition of critical inquiry about basic questions in life that seeks to establish consensus through argumentative persuasion.

                Philosophy classes are generally concerned with the narrow sense. They are interested less in the question of "what do you believe?" and more in the question of "what can you prove?" Or to put it another way, "can you convince a reasonable skeptic?"

                In my intro phil class we used a "multicultural philosophy reader" and my experience was that while some of it was interesting, most of the non-western stuff was either non-argumentative, or if it was argumentative, it required the reader to accept an entire system of thought such as Islam or Buddhism before they could chew on the meat of the argument. Westerners for the most part don't already buy into these systems of thought, so it's difficult to get them to engage the argumentative point at issue. For example, we read one author who made an argument rooted in Islam that feminism is causing the destruction of western civilization. Perhaps if you happen to accept the divine authority of the Koran, this seems like a sensible thing to say. But from the perspective of most westerners, this amounts to using superstition to justify bigotry. Why not appeal to the tooth fairy to justify slavery while we're at it!

                For these reasons, I think a focus on the body of literature that began in ancient Greece and flowered in Europe and North America is less unreasonable than it might seem at first glance. It's great to be familiar with other systems of thought, but there are difficulties in using the intro-to-philosophy classroom to grow that familiarity, especially given how wide and deep the domain of western philosophy already is. I know some departments will offer classes on Eastern philosophy. I always wanted to take one, but the prof who taught it at my school was a prick.
                • Re: Philosophy Classes

                  Tue, October 23, 2007 - 6:18 AM
                  Well put. It does make sense, but a general outline (as was used in my own philosophy class - Hinduism), wouldn't be too bad. We were introduced to the concept of samsara, very basically. There was some interesting discussion on it. Most of my other classes which were not introductory were heavily eurocentric. Ethics was entirely western based. There is an eastern philosophy class offered - just one. So they are at least introduced . . . It wouldn't be a bad idea to have eastern/alternative concepts and philosophies combined with the critical, inquisitive thinking of western philosophy. A good combination you might say.
  • Re: Philosophy Classes

    Tue, October 30, 2007 - 2:51 PM
    philosophy itself, as we know it, in all its reflective, sophic glory, is primarily the concoction of white men. this is nothing to say about all the other world views and metaphysicians out there constructing beliefs, myths, stories, etc. but nobody can dissect the meaning of dissecting the logic of dissecting a hair better than white european men.

    the philosophy departments around academia are entirely eurocentric and according to one of my professor friends academia is still entirely sexist as well. the limits to this experience are a hefty price to pay considering our day and age. is it a wonder the liberal arts suffer from the budget cuts- the liberal arts programs suck and are out of date. perhaps if there was a demand for something better and a genral improvement to the curriculum liberal arts might make a comeback.

    maybe that was part of the plan? philosophy is one of the places cultures can really shine in there own uniqueness and idioysyncracy (as opposed to say, math). perhaps by the establishment offering only white philosophy we would forget that good philosophy does exist and other cultures do shine out in such a prestigious activity (as Plato would have it). it was all a ruse. give us only our crappy version and we won't think to look in the rest of the world for better options. soon enough we can quit funding the programs all together and know will know how to think for themselves.

    btw, i have also read that the ancient greeks spent extensive time in africa, egypt primarily; but also india. Plato had friends and knew of indian philosphy.
    • Re: Philosophy Classes

      Tue, October 30, 2007 - 10:28 PM
      OK, I agree with you up to the point where you start ragging on European philosophy. It's not trash. It's not a "crappy version" of philosophy. It's simply not the whole picture.
      • Re: Philosophy Classes

        Wed, November 7, 2007 - 3:32 PM
        myriad
        thanks for keeping me honest (european philosphy isn't all bad)...but on the other hand, when a discipline is as slow to embrace the possibility of hetergeneous discourse as western philosphy has been, well, that calls for something to be said. it is not just that it is incomplete, for the longest time the discipline, and all those white men involved, held a strangehold on the issues; and did so under the guise of seeking absolute or objective truth. i hold a grudge.

        when these discourses become subject to an academia or a church run by white men with an agenda we are justified in holding these traditions suspect because things just get worse (worse meaning more rigid).

        i love william james, i read him all the time. great thinker, but still a stuffy white guy from...?harvard? i wouldn't trust james any further than i would trust any white male philosopher...not that they are bad people - we just have different requirements as readers nowadays. and academia is tragically behind.

        it is hard to be critical of something i am so grateful for. i would not trade my course work in philosophy for anything, yet i often wonder in what ways my learning might have been unnecessarily hindered by an out of date pedagogy. perhaps it is not the text themselves at all but rather how they are offered to us and absorbed by us.

        c
        • Re: Philosophy Classes

          Wed, November 7, 2007 - 11:14 PM
          I hold nothing against white men and refuse to blame them for being born into a system that set them up as authorities. I actually believe the white male has suffered as much from his own rule as any other group. I will listen to white male philosophers. I will listen to black female philosophers. I will listen to purple hermaphroditice philosophers and green neuter philosophers (I've been to Burning Man, don't discount the posibility). I listen to philosophy and while the source is considered it is simply more information; a psychological footnote to theory and thought.
        • Re: Philosophy Classes

          Thu, November 8, 2007 - 1:00 PM
          It's hard to take this seriously when the main driving force of the complaint seems to be racism/sexism against white males.

          Might as well complain that you don't like rap music because it's primarily made by black males. But wait...that would be racist! I find it a little disturbing how comfortable with double standards political correctness has made us.

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